Excellence Is a Process and Not a Result - Brad Stulberg

00:00:00: If I said that anyone can be excellent at anything, i would want you to dismiss all of my work immediately because thats just horseshit.

00:00:07: What I found in researching for the way of excellence is people who are very high performing whatever they do whether it's sport medicine business creativity.

00:00:17: You have to a little bit crazy.

00:00:19: There s this saying that athletes die two deaths.

00:00:21: They die when their retire and then they die.

00:00:24: If that is the only thing, if there's no Juan Ferdino outside of The Athlete?

00:00:28: That a very fragile situation because... ...if an injury happens then who am I. And for race goes poorly what does it say about me?

00:01:04: Correct me if I'm wrong.

00:01:05: are in that sort of self-help kind of broader space when you're struggling.

00:01:11: So just from my side, I think peak performance was the first book of yours that I read during a time of injury that i picked it up and Simplicity that I could never see.

00:01:29: I feel like i was always standing a little bit close to too Close To the tree, actually through The forest and i feel Like you were able to give me That kind of distance.

00:01:37: Maybe for those listeners that don't know You?

00:01:40: Could just Give us A broad interview or Broad broad idea Of who you are.

00:01:45: yeah well first off thank you so much For saying that it's real honor to be speaking with you.

00:01:49: as i said before We got in the air have long been a fan of yours followed your career, so we could just sit here and fanboy on each other.

00:01:57: And perhaps we'll do a little bit of that but hopefully for the listener will also get into some good stuff I'd say that i wear three predominant hats.

00:02:06: The the first and primary hat, uh professionally these hats at least is a writer.

00:02:12: Uh if you're writing as my primary craft in...I'm really interested in exploring performance excellence in-in really human flourishing.

00:02:20: so what does it mean to live a good meaningful life?

00:02:23: Uh into grow and create and contribute while we are here on this planet.

00:02:28: The second hat that I wear is as a performance coach.

00:02:32: This happened by accident about a decade ago.

00:02:34: after one of my books really hit stride and took off, many people especially athletes started asking me if would coach them?

00:02:42: And I had no background in coaching or certificate for two years.

00:02:46: then eventually said yeah im gonna try this to see how it goes.

00:02:50: since then i've built up small but very meaningful coaching practice.

00:02:55: And then the third hat that I wear is, I'm on adjunct faculty at The University of Michigan where i lecture in their graduate school and um... In a course on self-coaching.

00:03:06: The thing is we're here On the show.

00:03:09: uh... Frodeno Going Mental!

00:03:10: ...in this case Stahlberg going mental.

00:03:13: Traditionally We start off with real questions by hearing your definition Of GOING MENTAL.

00:03:23: What does going mental mean to me?

00:03:26: I think in many ways it comes down to being yourself and going all the way.

00:03:37: And that means you have to know who really are.

00:03:41: You've got your values, yourself and then the guts and courage to care deeply into.

00:03:46: go all of way step in arena give it a shot.

00:03:49: obviously this could be true sport but also relationships parenting running business being creative just about anything.

00:03:57: life.

00:03:59: That's certainly the best articulation of the going mental we've had.

00:04:03: We have all sorts definitions, I think by a hundredth episode will have broad definition what it means to people from different craft.

00:04:13: Maybe you can start off with the current Olympics?

00:04:15: I read your work currently ties in well with recently released book excellence and i would really love hear your take on.

00:04:28: Well the kind of Norwegian method that's been going around in triathlon.

00:04:32: It's been a hype That's very, very different to.

00:04:36: it's almost the opposite Of what is now in the mainstream media as an avoid your Norwegian method?

00:04:41: Kind of what we have in triathalon was this data-driven exact kind of taking hundred lactate samples a day and you know really getting into the nitty gritty of things Whereas what we've seen from the Norwegians has been completely different.

00:04:55: maybe take us into your thoughts On on the development and what it means for athletes up-and-coming.

00:05:03: well, I think that area of it.

00:05:05: No best here is particularly The Norwegians Approach to youth sports into having a large athlete pipeline in.

00:05:14: Before i go too deep Into this answer i do want To mention an important caveat which Is there are multiple factors That explain norway's success?

00:05:24: in performance at an individual level is complex.

00:05:26: At a societal level, it's even more complex.

00:05:28: so I'm not saying this the only thing.

00:05:30: however based on a lot of research i do think that actually be driving force.

00:05:34: uh... so first pushback you get whenever he tried to identify reason why norway dominates and sport as people say.

00:05:41: well they're only good at the winter olympics And that's actually not true.

00:05:45: As you mentioned, they're very strong in triathlon.

00:05:48: They have a world-class athletics program and particularly middle distance events which are very popular.

00:05:55: They won gold in beach volleyball Decidedly summer sports there.

00:05:59: extremely strong in cycling.

00:06:00: the produce some of the best soccer players.

00:06:02: So so they're quite good.

00:06:03: go ahead.

00:06:03: You were gonna say something

00:06:05: random fact The Beach Volleyball World champions and Christian Blumentfeldt who is a Triathlon champion an Olympic Champion.

00:06:13: They are born in the same street.

00:06:15: They live on the same Street anyway, I mean talk about density of talent.

00:06:19: So

00:06:21: so yeah?

00:06:21: It's not just that they're a winter winter wonderland because that's what people always say is oh The reason there's no good at Winter Sports Is Because it's Always Winter There.

00:06:30: um So That can Explain it.

00:06:33: and then People Say well how do they Do In the Summer Olympics?

00:06:35: And The truth is they win three times the medals per capita than America.

00:06:39: So people often think of America as this summer Olympics powerhouse, but Norway is-is the size of a suburb in New York City.

00:06:47: it is very small and per capita's not a perfect measure But it's the best we've got.

00:06:52: so there's gotta be something going on that affects all athletes and all seasons.

00:06:56: And the biggest difference between the Norwegians to many other countries Is how they treat youth sports.

00:07:03: So in Norway, the entire philosophy is joy.

00:07:07: And the entire goal is to have everybody participate in youth sports until the age of thirteen.

00:07:13: They don't keep score, scorekeeping is actually illegal till age eleven.

00:07:17: in Norway when trophies are handed out every body gets a trophy.

00:07:21: so here at least in this states people would call you snowflake and they'd say oh The kids are gonna lose their competitive edge.

00:07:27: In norway if it's six year old wants a trophy because It makes him or her feel good then You give the six-year-old a trophy cuz.

00:07:32: The only goal is getting people to continue in sport.

00:07:36: And as a result, we're... In America, seventy percent of kids quit sports by age thirteen.

00:07:42: the number one and two reasons they give are it's not fun anymore or too much pressure.

00:07:51: So you just have this enormous pipeline of athlete development, it's a huge part the culture.

00:07:56: and then kids can specialize in get more serious once they've gone through puberty when their older.

00:08:00: When your have sense what sport might actually be best at whereas here is states would ends up happening as kid specialized age seven or eight.

00:08:08: They completely burn themselves out.

00:08:09: They don't have the growth spurt that their parents thought they'd had and on, and there are probably so many great athletes that have quit before they've even developed into their bodies.

00:08:20: So what I take out of the Norwegian approach is that youth sport should be fun.

00:08:23: The goal should be participation in the goals should be developing a lifelong love Of sports and skill development And we should not specialize.

00:08:31: We should not get serious until age thirteen at the earliest.

00:08:35: this is a little bit of A mind-boggling one for me because I think we're both dads and I was firmly Of the opinion that my kids score should be kept And That this kind of attitude of everybody Is the same?

00:08:51: Everybody gets the same shot, and i'm like well Nobody Gets The Same Marks in Maths nobody Get's.

00:08:59: you know it gets gets marked up For Trying In History or Anything Like that.

00:09:03: So why not apply the growth mindset to my seven-year old son or something like that?

00:09:09: It's, well if you want a place better.

00:09:11: You just train little bit more and it kind of fared well but its really gotten me reconsidered.

00:09:19: Yeah so...you also have operate within context in your country.

00:09:23: My sons eights.

00:09:24: he turned eight.

00:09:25: our boys are actually at same age.

00:09:27: I coach his basketball team And in the States, they do keep score.

00:09:30: We actually just won the championship.

00:09:32: so I'm not a purist and not going to drop out of league because it keeps score on.

00:09:37: however It's this spirit that i've embraced which is hey we don't have to be serious at age.

00:09:44: The reason for this is multi variable.

00:09:48: First all competitive kids are gonna keep scoring their heads anyways.

00:09:53: So my son Was keeping score in kindergarten before there was any scoreboard.

00:09:56: He'd come over to the bench and he tell me because he's naturally competitive.

00:10:00: However, there were kids on the team that we're very intimidated by That.

00:10:04: And those are the kids that drop out?

00:10:06: Those who quit or want to keep in sport as long As you have little sense of if your five-year old is going To mature into a great athlete.

00:10:16: So I think that the alphas to use a kind of slang term, like those kids are gonna be competitive and keep score anyways.

00:10:24: So this isn't about them it's everybody

00:10:27: else.".

00:10:27: And I think even for the kids that are naturally inclined At the end of day, it should still be really fun.

00:10:35: I have a story that made me proud of my approach to youth sports as parents.

00:10:42: so like i said he just won his eight?

00:10:44: u basketball championship and they get this big trophy.

00:10:47: all the parents are crazy.

00:10:49: you know its whole American sports thing.

00:10:51: And then after we go to this pizza place also on arcade He plays one of those claw games where you give him dollar and reach in with the claw And he wins two stuffies.

00:11:01: He's never won the claw before.

00:11:03: in just thirty minutes ago, you want that?

00:11:06: The county championship for basketball and for the rest of the day, the only thing that he wanted to talk about was how he won the Claw.

00:11:12: my parents who live out a town his grandparents they called him to ask about as basketball game.

00:11:16: You wouldn't even address it.

00:11:17: Basketball is fine but I won the claw.

00:11:19: and if you could look at that two ways, you can Look at that and say this kids got no drive No competitive edge.

00:11:25: Or you could look at it and say, he's just eight.

00:11:28: He's having fun in...he is not putting pressure on himself.

00:11:32: He isn't making his identity or life about sport which he shouldn't at age eight And I'm a big believer of the latter.

00:11:40: So i have two things to do with that.

00:11:43: One quite few races in my life..I've lost some too but never won the claw.

00:11:50: so statistically he has done really well.

00:11:53: I'll tell Theo, what is it?

00:11:55: A three-time world champion but he's never won the claw.

00:11:57: Is that right?

00:11:58: you've got three right.

00:12:00: Well depends on how you count of course three long and two middle in one team.

00:12:04: so technically.

00:12:05: Yeah let's call it six.

00:12:06: there

00:12:06: we go.

00:12:07: i was just counting the long ones.

00:12:09: yeah exactly But It is So important as to What's relevant Right And also kind Of.

00:12:17: I mean You speak a lot In The book About How Long Something Is Relevant for I would agree that there's so much complexity.

00:12:24: Just going back on kids keeping scored, you think it is a societal thing still though?

00:12:31: That we somehow instill into the kid in a society level rather than... In Norway do you think kids naturally keep score as well?

00:12:40: when i'm trying to say?

00:12:43: I haven't done enough anthropological research of embedding myself with Norwegian sports teams.

00:12:49: I can tell you that it's not all, let's hold hands and sing Kumbaya in Smell the Roses.

00:12:54: Because once kids hit eleven twelve thirteen at Norway then they get very serious And specialize.

00:12:59: They have academies There is a really meticulous talent selection program.

00:13:04: So i sense That The competitive kids are still probably keeping track But do think there s lot less pressure because its just so embedded into culture.

00:13:16: Everyone plays sport.

00:13:17: We love Sport Whereas, and I can only speak for America but i think this is true in Canada.

00:13:22: In Germany And the UK and lots of other places...I Think what happens Is that parents egos get in The way?

00:13:28: And..the parents really want their kids to love spore and To be good at spore into win because it makes the parents feel Good!

00:13:36: It becomes less about the Kids and more About the Parents whereas my understanding is That just does not happen in Norway.

00:13:43: Yeah, our forever obsession with childhood prodigies and living vicariously through out children is kind of yeah It's kind of awkward.

00:13:50: But I tell you what it's actually come to me because Reading a few your articles and obviously staying in touch with the Olympics And when what's going on?

00:13:59: Really forcing myself to rethink my attitude on all of this Kind of made me realize that i've always described My parents as anti-sports right like my parents.

00:14:10: They just sport was soccer back in the eighties, in Germany.

00:14:14: And soccer was only to be played by you know... By the non-intellectual class whatever you call that.

00:14:21: um and it wasn't to be followed right?

00:14:24: There was just sport with an absolute taboo.

00:14:27: but then made me realize really until I learned to swim at age fifteen i was just allowed to play!

00:14:33: And I was out all day because I do believe have some kind of hyperactivity need sport in order function.

00:14:40: Maybe I did have that Norwegian upbringing without ever thinking about it.

00:14:44: And here i am trying to apply the things That only really worked for me as a fifteen, you know?

00:14:50: Then there was a hard cut and everything was about times... ...and had this hardcore Hungarian swim coach who would just stand cracking the whip.

00:14:58: But I was much older!

00:15:00: It is amazing how those kind of times make you rethink your own history.

00:15:08: Talking bout YOUR HISTORY.

00:15:11: You've changed gears all together, right?

00:15:15: you have a background in consulting.

00:15:17: Is that right?

00:15:18: That's right.

00:15:19: small background but out of undergraduate school.

00:15:21: So is it?

00:15:22: very young person?

00:15:23: what was I?

00:15:24: twenty two years old?

00:15:25: i spent uh... Two years in consulting.

00:15:28: then went back to graduate school, started writing in Graduate School but as a hobby took corporate job out of Graduate School.

00:15:36: Continued to write on the side caught some lucky breaks and I've been writing professionally for last little more than

00:15:42: decade.".

00:15:59: Wanting to apply some change in their life wanting to have a transition and discovering a passion what as a coach.

00:16:08: What is your advice?

00:16:09: two people well such as myself going through the transition or generally anybody who was out and diving into cold water trying something completely new,

00:16:27: Particularly in someone's cases like yours where you've done something at the highest level, and we're presumably making an assumption about that thing has been an outsized part of how to define yourself.

00:16:42: There is a saying that athletes die two deaths.

00:16:44: I don't know if ever heard this.

00:16:46: they die when they retire.

00:16:48: yeah i'm sure you felt it so its extremely hard.

00:16:57: The second thing that I would say is, so many of the attributes made you a great athlete are transferable to other things.

00:17:08: And those attributes don't die and those attributes do not go away—that drive, obsession, competitiveness, fire or joy…the ability focus into lock-in!

00:17:19: Those are extremely valuable in all sorts whether they're in a weather the developed or some combination.

00:17:30: these kind of psychological weapons are tools and for the longest time they had an outlet that you could point them at.

00:17:36: And now you need to find the right outlet for them, it's best thing to do is to sample exactly what your doing.

00:17:44: start a podcast maybe started small company try to write a book, try to coach.

00:17:49: I don't know what the thing is gonna be but you're never just going immediately slide into next things and find perfect fit or at least very rarely so.

00:17:59: in that book i talk about um... You wanna quit often until your finds fit?

00:18:05: and then once you find fit, you want to lean on grit.

00:18:07: And what I mean by that is you should have a sampling period where you try things—you take those weapons the psychological tools and see uh...what they fit in.

00:18:14: when it doesn't feel right don't be scared to quit!

00:18:17: When it does start to feel right…that's when its time to dig-in..and have that persistence.

00:18:22: ummm….that is another one of these psychological tools.

00:18:26: really digging from there.

00:18:29: but y'know....I can only imagine how hard for someone like you, because on the one hand I can sound like oh Brad's got this figured out.

00:18:37: But in other hands i've lived these transitions at a millionth of that level and it was still heartbreaking.

00:18:46: so by all means a shitty runner right?

00:18:49: My marathon PR is three-o-one.

00:18:51: Nowhere near an elite runner!

00:18:54: And when it became really clear about this calf injury wasn't going to get better.

00:18:59: I had about two months where every time I was outside and people ran by me, I had panic.

00:19:08: Like I felt a ten out of ten anxiety in my body because I saw these other runners.

00:19:12: then they said if that's... If i'm not that anymore than like who am I as an athlete?

00:19:18: It was really hard!

00:19:20: And I got through those two months and kept showing up telling myself hey this is just the part of who I am.

00:19:25: it' s all over And fast forward over ten years.

00:19:29: and now you couldn't pay me a million dollars to run again.

00:19:31: I don't know why, why did all that running?

00:19:32: To begin with... But the point is like- Like with time The hurt in kind of knife's edge softens.

00:19:41: You get these new things that light up and excite you.

00:19:47: Of course there always some sort of comparison but one of most helpful thing someone said to my last few years Is you cannot quantify suffering.

00:19:56: And, you know how it doesn't actually matter if your running three hours or two fifty.

00:20:00: You're running five hours and doing something completely altogether.

00:20:03: that is the most relevant thing to you at that very time.

00:20:09: Do y'know about Solomon's paradox?

00:20:13: No say more.

00:20:14: So as the myth goes King Solomon was spoken too had a word with God himself.

00:20:23: What he asked for is that he be given the heart and the compassion to be able to listen to others, and to help them.

00:20:34: Okay?

00:20:35: And so... He was able to help people in his following-he's been able to support his country!

00:20:42: And everyone very happy except for himself because his advice only worked with other people..and couldn't self diagnose.

00:20:56: And basically, what happened is that his kingdom fell apart within the next two decades after he passed away.

00:21:05: I wonder if you ever fall into that?

00:21:06: That you have all this advice and you have these things exactly like before.

00:21:11: we've lived through a million one-things... ...and can tell them to someone else.

00:21:15: yet applying as change in your own life how do you deal with

00:21:19: it?".

00:21:21: I try to shoot sixty to seventy percent.

00:21:25: and if I can shoot sixty to seventy percent on the things that are in my book, then i think im doing a great job.

00:21:31: And thats the same advice I'd give any reader of material is like don't try be perfect you're gonna drive yourself crazy and your kinda missing the point.

00:21:40: um... The point it's take these ideas to take this insights to wrestle with them To Be aware of Them and just be good enough.

00:21:47: Um, I pride myself on consistency.

00:21:49: Consistency is a father, consistency as a husband, consistency has writer and the big part of consistency for me is like you don't... You pick your spots to be great but generally speaking, you just have to be good enough day in and day out.

00:22:02: um so that's how i think about it.

00:22:04: And then there's also this difference between knowledge and wisdom.

00:22:09: In Knowledge Is Something That You Know In Your Head?

00:22:12: In Wisdom It'S Something ThatYouKnowInYourBones.

00:22:16: I just think that knowledge can help you better absorb wisdom, but sometimes you just have to live through things.

00:22:25: To really get it!

00:22:27: So its not say a great book cant change your life and put myself out of business if i said this.

00:22:31: Its not saying a great books cant make sense in the world But often times the great book primes you And then you have to live through something.

00:22:40: You have to have an experience, uh...to fully get

00:22:42: it.".

00:22:43: I actually think of my job first and foremost as interesting at the start of that episode-I don't know if he said self help or personal development but i really dont' think about myself in a business giving advice with my books believe it or not..i think my primary job is writer Is To find words In language for things.

00:23:02: people feel deep down inside And they probably already even know, but they don't yet have words for it.

00:23:08: They don't have a tangible way to express it and try to give them words.

00:23:13: that's how I really view my job.

00:23:15: That is exactly what i was trying say in the introduction.

00:23:17: like there were so many concepts deep down

00:23:21: What are the best ever at what you do?

00:23:29: So, You know these things.

00:23:30: I'm not going to teach anything or maybe i'll teach a couple of thing but hopefully what can be done is name them and give language for those that feel like they don't have words in it.

00:23:41: if i could then im doing my job as writer.

00:23:44: It's interesting because so many readers say oh this book changed all their life.

00:23:49: did u really learn somethings?

00:23:50: Actually!

00:23:51: I kinda knew that But you gave me way to say it Or think about it.

00:23:55: Thats My Job.

00:23:57: Yeah, I mean of course and the thing is different chapters touch us at different chapters in our life very differently.

00:24:03: right?

00:24:03: there's completely like something I may just browse over on a few years later In a different context will be very different.

00:24:10: And it It's weird how brain is kind of primed to Observe that things?

00:24:16: I mean up forever say our brain is prime to avoid pain.

00:24:19: Right whether this physical

00:24:20: or or

00:24:21: psychological.

00:24:23: And so therefore, the things we perceive and the things that actually pick up on are completely different in different stages.

00:24:29: Which brings you back to... The concept of what you said.

00:24:33: athletes die twice.

00:24:35: This is something I actually picked it from Dirk Nowitzki.

00:24:39: It's one those thing obviously gets thrown around a lot at this moment when you retire You speak about identity house A concept I struggle with a little bit.

00:24:52: So first of all, maybe you explain what do see under the identity house and why he think it's important?

00:24:57: All right so this is great topic.

00:25:00: um What i found in researching for The Way Of Excellence Is that people who are very high performing at whatever they do whether its sport medicine business creativity You have to be a little crazy.

00:25:15: You have to spend an outsized proportion of your time and energy on your primary pursuit.

00:25:20: You have make all kinds sacrifices in trade-offs, at times you even need obsessive.

00:25:27: sometimes that can be borderline unhealthy.

00:25:29: All is true.

00:25:30: Anyone who tells you cake walk away to excellence.

00:25:34: it's full crap.

00:25:35: It just not true.

00:25:37: However I started to realize that the individuals who fared best, both from a performance standpoint and mental health standpoint made sure there was always more till how they defined their sense of self in identity than just their primary thing.

00:25:54: So your primary is sport or triathlon.

00:26:00: if it's not one for Dino outside of an athlete then this situation would be very fragile Because if an injury happens, well then who am I?

00:26:09: If a race goes poorly.

00:26:10: Well than what does that say about me?

00:26:12: when retirement comes not only are you gonna die your every part of every cell of your body is going to die like You have To Have More to Your Identity Than One Thing.

00:26:21: So What ends up Happening Though Is That?

00:26:23: Then the phrase balance gets thrown around.

00:26:25: It's like, oh you know just why don't you be a little bit more balanced?

00:26:28: Well let me tell you something nobody pursuing excellence at the highest level is balanced and if you have a temperament where you're listening to this podcast we are interested in going mental.

00:26:36: You're probably not very balanced person And there's nothing wrong with that.

00:26:40: In trying to force yourself To become balanced your gonna make yourself miserable.

00:26:44: There are people who simply wired to push or wire to wanna go all-in.

00:26:48: So I sat there When writing the book and I'm like well, how do i?

00:26:51: How.

00:26:52: Do I reconcile this paradox?

00:26:54: because I've seen a million times in my reporting And there's some research to show it too that when you fuse your entire self-to one thing The outcomes are bad.

00:27:01: but none of these people myself included could ever be balanced In.

00:27:05: That's what has started to think about identity Like A house.

00:27:08: so if You have a House It only Has One Room in it.

00:27:11: in That One room Catches Fire or Floods.

00:27:13: You Have To Move out Of the House Entirely Its.

00:27:15: It's going to Be Extremely Disorienting and Discombobulating.

00:27:18: But if you have a house that has more than one room and one room catches fire or floods, You can seek refuge in the other rooms.

00:27:26: So we want to think about our identities this same way.

00:27:29: now what's fascinating about this metaphor?

00:27:30: And why I like it is The Rooms don't Have To Be The Same Size!

00:27:34: You Don't Have to Spend The Same Amount Of Time & Energy In Each Room...You

00:27:37: WON'T!!!

00:27:38: You Just Want To Make Sure That You Have More Than One Room And None of The Important Rooms Get

00:27:42: Moldy!!

00:27:43: So In My Identity House The Primary Rooms Are my Craftroom Where Im A Writer My family room where I'm a father and husband, in the my athlete room.

00:27:51: Where am an athlete?

00:27:52: And then i have some smaller rooms!

00:27:54: I Have A Room Where Im A Community Member...I Have A ROOM WHERE IM A FRIEND.

00:27:57: In different seasons..different phases of my life....i look very unbalanced.

00:28:01: you know im putting out a book.

00:28:03: right now almost all my time & energy is spent in The Craftroom but make sure that the Family Room doesn't get moldy.

00:28:10: so what does this mean?

00:28:11: it means Even in the middle of a book launch, I'm not gonna travel more than three times a month.

00:28:15: I'm going to make sure that I still coach my kid's basketball team this season.

00:28:18: I'll be making sure we have family dinners whenever i am in town.

00:28:22: Am I being THE best husband and THE best father ever been?

00:28:27: Absolutely NOT!

00:28:28: But I spend enough time in THAT room to make SURE again it doesn't get too messy.

00:28:32: Same thing with ATHLETE.

00:28:34: Normally I train five days a week...am I training five days right now?

00:28:36: Heck no but I make sure to train THREE DAYS A WEEK.

00:28:39: Am I following strict progressive overload like I normally do right now?

00:28:43: No.

00:28:44: But, make sure that i'm still focusing on my three major lifts and moving them in the right direction And then once they get out of this book launch period The balance will shift.

00:28:52: So it's a very long answer but thought its important to go into detail.

00:28:55: so thats how you think about having an identity house.

00:29:05: This didn't exist for me like I did not.

00:29:14: Uh, i was the guy living in a loft that there was one room and everything Was In That Room And That Was Being A Triathlete?

00:29:22: I Lived And Breathe By Every Session.

00:29:25: Everything Had A Completely Outsized Relevance To Me And I had Andrea Petkovich On The Podcast Who She Was Former Top Ten WTA Tennis Player.

00:29:39: She kind of always was a tennis player, but she says she was a writer born into her tennis players body.

00:29:48: You know?

00:29:48: She's extremely poetic and-and she has exactly this kind of duality where she has something else.

00:29:55: And we were talking about the idea in the concept Of whether This actually gives you an option.

00:30:03: Right when injury comes When All the odds are stacked against me when everything is kind of saying no, and the rational thing to do is move on.

00:30:16: Start studying get somewhere else.

00:30:18: I didn't have an alternative had nothing else And nowadays i have an identity house and i fulfill similar roles.

00:30:26: what you do except my writing Is much smaller?

00:30:37: This might be a healthy approach, but when we get into excellence in the second and that definition thereof it doesn't really demand a healthier approach.

00:30:48: It demands an extreme approach.

00:30:51: as I write In The Book i think you have to Be A Little Bit Crazy But You Can't Be Too Crazy.

00:30:57: So Let Me Ask You A Couple Questions.

00:30:59: I'm Gonna Turn The Tables.

00:31:01: When Did You Get Married?

00:31:02: Uh,

00:31:04: oh gosh.

00:31:05: My wife was sitting here in two thousand and thirteen.

00:31:06: I met her on two thousand nine.

00:31:09: Okay In when were your best?

00:31:12: remind me?

00:31:12: When you're best racing years where?

00:31:15: Um probably fifteen to nineteen

00:31:20: okay And this is the same life.

00:31:23: no divorce in between

00:31:24: Nope All

00:31:26: right.

00:31:26: So i would argue that You've got at least one other room in Your identity house which Is your marriage and my sense is that even when you were living in that loft with the single-minded focus, your marriage was an enormous bolster for you.

00:31:39: And I'm not just saying this because I know your wife's listening but my guess is when you are in The Darkest Hour... ...the fact that you had your wife and you have your marriage probably helped through in a way it wouldn't have otherwise.

00:31:50: So..I would challenge you But maybe you're gonna tell me no until your wife to cover her ears.

00:31:55: Maybe It Was Just Locked In.

00:32:00: But truly, because I think a lot of people that go all in and... Listen.

00:32:05: I can't imagine at times your career or pursuit of excellence strange marriage but you're able to keep it together cause here you are In A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT GO ALL IN AND GET SO UPSESSED.

00:32:17: They don't keep their marriages together they blow up the family life And they THINK IT'S HELPING THEM Cause they think its one less thing i have to worry about when they need that source of resilience, it's not there.

00:32:28: So even amidst your crazy obsession.

00:32:31: I'd still say like you had another room.

00:32:34: Okay so i'll agree with that a hundred percent because especially my son is actually little bit older.

00:32:40: he was born in twenty sixteen which was right at the phase where...

00:32:44: Oh then what are you talking about?

00:32:48: This-I only interject and I say this with a smile on my face.

00:32:51: but What's fascinating is Chelsea Cidero, who recently won a woman's long course world championship.

00:32:56: She did it after she had her kid like.

00:32:58: so you obviously have other rooms in your identity house Now.

00:33:03: do you spend more time with your son now than you did and the build up for an Iron Man?

00:33:06: Absolutely.

00:33:08: But what people think The David Goggins approach is literally.

00:33:13: apparently he has an absent father.

00:33:15: I don't know that was his daughter said but That approaches no marriage No friends.

00:33:22: You're all in and that's what I take issue with because you're a living example of it.

00:33:25: That's not true, you know?

00:33:27: You're married And he just told me that you had your kid right before your hot streak.

00:33:31: Yeah hundred percent.

00:33:32: i will agree that that basically got to the finest point.

00:33:35: The thing is To get there to get to that level Right to start from From learning to swim to actually Get like.

00:33:44: i won the olympics In two thousand eight.

00:33:46: so that was A fair while ahead Of To the level where you then need to kind of have a few more rooms.

00:33:56: I always find that You know actors.

00:33:58: they talk about how?

00:34:02: And to get there, to get to that stage.

00:34:25: To be able to appreciate and have the self-confidence also step away from my craft at certain times took an immense kind of singular focus.

00:34:39: That's where I struggle with having various rooms in all time.

00:34:45: In terms it is something you develop later on.

00:34:49: That's really the point I was trying to make.

00:34:51: So then

00:35:14: you're taking like the years of your life between I don't know.

00:35:16: You tell me sixteen and twenty six.

00:35:20: Is that about right?

00:35:22: Sixteen to yeah, twenty seven twenty thirty even thirty.

00:35:25: Yeah in during that stretch you're saying that it was just single-minded obsession.

00:35:33: I really wouldn't have known anything else.

00:35:36: yet.

00:35:38: Were you intellectually engaged?

00:35:40: Like, were you reading books?

00:35:41: where did you have any anything else that you did?

00:35:43: or was it literally just like workout obsess about your work out sleep.

00:35:47: Workout Obsess About Your Work Out Sleep?

00:35:49: I Was pretty much a vegetable in that time.

00:35:52: i honestly started reading Pretty much as I retired now read the book of week.

00:35:56: You know I love but back then yeah couldn't even listen to podcast during training.

00:36:00: It's Just Always This Monofocus on just trying to get a little bit better or I'm trying to pursue that.

00:36:06: That was literally the cat chasing the mouse.

00:36:09: Yeah, so it's interesting that you bring this up?

00:36:11: I think that um i Think your experience is not completely uncommon.

00:36:17: I don't think it's the path that everybody takes.

00:36:20: Um in the book and in the chapter on caring I talk about how A huge part of excellence is like throwing your all into something And yeah making at your world then carrying deeply.

00:36:31: I think thats what you're saying.

00:36:32: And then I also think about what in the literature is called explore than exploit.

00:36:39: What that means, you want to go through cycles of exploring different things in your life and maybe it's from age eight-fifteen?

00:36:45: Then when you find something working just explode like all in!

00:36:50: And there's fascinating research that shows in creatives too, like the way creative people work and cycles is.

00:36:57: they explore.

00:36:58: They read a lot.

00:36:58: They listen to music.

00:36:59: They have conversations.

00:37:00: when they find... ...they find the idea it's clicking for them at that moment then spend five years just going deeper and deeper.

00:37:07: This how so many Nobel Prize winning scientists work?

00:37:11: Is they explore?

00:37:12: They explore?

00:37:12: Puddle around?

00:37:13: Finds an idea and exploit.

00:37:15: I think maybe to some extent what you're describing is like, you spent your childhood exploring different sports and then you found something where it clicked.

00:37:23: And then you went all in and you exploited it.

00:37:26: um In-and i'm not going to disagree!

00:37:29: I do think especially at the level that you competed at To try to be the best in the world at Something You probably need a period of exploiting Where if It's Not A single minded obsession and focus?

00:37:41: Its very close to That.

00:37:44: I do find it interesting though that you had your maybe most winning years when You did have some of these like the other rooms in the identity house didn't hurt.

00:37:50: You um.

00:37:52: But yeah, i think That you're right and i don't Think its bad advice for someone that really wants to be The best-in-the world at something To spend Some years going all In on On that thing.

00:38:04: Um i think the danger is if It doesn't work out And you Don't win World Championships or you don't meet your wife then and i dont say this is a joke like are u even still here.

00:38:18: Because it's really sad and risky story which the athlete that does exactly what you're saying in the chips do not follow their way, and there was deep dark depression that follows?

00:38:30: Yeah hundred percent.

00:38:31: I mean they will be deeper depressions during as well right when things go to plan if you have no other option to keep going yet kind of... Yeah, I see exactly all the points that you make in terms of how to persist and... You know?

00:38:46: You speak about it on a book as well.

00:38:48: Like when do you make sure that the ladder you're trying keep climbing actually leans against the right wall which is a metaphor-.

00:38:55: So

00:38:55: then here's another question because i also think this is fascinating for me!

00:38:59: I feel like im interviewing you now little bit Which was fun.

00:39:02: It always easier be asking questions If Do YOU THINK THAT YOU WERE GREAT BECAUSE OF THAT APPROACH OR IN SPITE OF IT?

00:39:10: And do you think that if you were counseling a sixteen year old or twenty-year-old, who wants to be the best in this world would tell them what they did?

00:39:20: Or would you want to be ninety five percent focused here but just an hour a day.

00:39:27: I want you to have something else.

00:39:55: did have that old school kind of attitude, you know all in basically my dad despite hating sports early on.

00:40:04: Hating is a strong word but being against sport um kind of told me whatever you do don't study and do sports because if you're not all-in then the person who is all in will pass.

00:40:18: And this is kind of like something that's childhood ingrained, where I always believe you have to be all-in.

00:40:24: You have to have the absolute monofocus in order to get at it very best.

00:40:31: Now could i have done differently?

00:40:36: Is there an attempt for faith ?

00:40:39: I'm not really sure because as you say complex kind of system, right?

00:40:46: And if you change one thing who knows what else would come.

00:40:50: But

00:40:51: I do in hindsight even appreciate that when i was lying on the physio bench and my calf was torn or my Achilles was hurting... ...I knew That I would spend five hours a day on that tendon If I needed to because that was The only option I had!

00:41:09: that really gave me any light at the end of a tunnel and therefore, I'd probably do it again.

00:41:16: And you know would argue that It was in some part at least because of that Because You Know In The Tough Times That's What Kept Me Going.

00:41:26: Yeah!

00:41:27: I mean i obviously can't argue against you because like the proof is in the pudding...it worked.

00:41:33: Um..and I think that There there's attention on alot of these things because I open the podcast by saying be yourself and go all the way In like that's who you are.

00:41:43: Yeah, and to not do that You would have been fighting yourself And there other athletes Where they?

00:41:48: Do have Other interests in.

00:41:50: They can't Have That monofocus and then they try To and they don't perform as well.

00:41:55: So I think some of this is just also Like really knowing Yourself and embracing Who you know who you Are.

00:42:01: Well This Is Kind Of What i'd like to get into next because in your definition in the book of excellence and kind of process at you describe So what you go and say is that, You need to kind of walk the walk.

00:42:39: Yeah, I think that's a hundred percent right.

00:42:41: You have to have um you Have to have a big toolkit But you have to learn what tools work and what situations?

00:42:49: And not all tools are gonna Work the same for every person.

00:42:51: it's funny.

00:42:52: The other day i was reading uh...I Was reading some of the reviews Of the book which should never do on Amazon.

00:42:57: in.

00:42:57: most of them Are great!

00:42:58: There is one four-star review In.

00:43:01: i'm a perfectionist ,i want everything To be five stars.

00:43:04: We

00:43:05: all look at one.

00:43:05: we always look at ones And he says, I'd give this book five stars but it's not a how-to guide.

00:43:11: It doesn't tell you to be

00:43:12: excellent.".

00:43:13: Of course not because that is at the point of the book!

00:43:18: You know?

00:43:27: Um, so to your point.

00:43:37: Yeah I define excellent is an involved intimate engagement in a worthwhile pursuit that aligns with your values.

00:43:44: and what i mean by That Is the Involved Intimate Engagement?

00:43:47: You have To Care Deeply you Have To Give A Damn!

00:43:49: You Have To Be Very Close To What You Do.

00:43:52: You Know...In Your Case Triathlon Can't Just Be A Hobby Like.

00:43:55: It Has To be Something That You Really Care About And That You Enter Into An Intimate Relationship With.

00:44:00: We Often Think Of Intimacy Between Two People but you can have intimacy with a craft.

00:44:05: When I write a book, I am very intimate with the process of writing a book.

00:44:09: and then the worthwhile pursuit that aligns with your values... You have to go about it in way that align's with who are or person they want become.

00:44:18: so if value hard work dedication persistence resilience than sport like triathlon makes ton sense.

00:44:25: You know kinda going by the seat of your pants and novelty then trying to be a world-class triathlete makes no sense.

00:44:35: So when you put those things together, When you put involved engagement in caring and find a pursuit that aligns with your values any go all in uh... That result is process.

00:44:45: they can convert excellence.

00:44:49: okay because i'm up until now I understood your definition to me that excellence as a process

00:44:57: it isn't processed.

00:44:57: yeah That's what I agree.

00:45:00: So it is the process of going all in on something that aligns with your values,

00:45:05: which isn't interesting because i always define excellence as a process With an outstanding outcome like for me kind Of being excellent or trying to be excellent at Something.

00:45:20: but actual excellence For Me has Always been connected To An Output.

00:45:25: Yeah, and I don't disagree.

00:45:31: The way that i think of it is the output or outcome Is always a byproduct Of the excellent process.

00:45:41: So... I am not A process over outcomes person Because I think Outcomes matter a lot And too many people say Don't worry about outcomes.

00:45:51: That's bullshit.

00:45:52: There are reasons.

00:45:53: you keep score not at age eight, but it the professional level.

00:45:57: Um outcomes often have financial repercussions.

00:46:00: they lead to.

00:46:01: new.

00:46:01: opportunities like that really do matter.

00:46:03: however The way you're going get your best outcome is by having this deeply intimate engaged process and I think You can be extremely proficient in something And have good outcomes without being excellent.

00:46:19: I think the difference between excellence and proficiency is, excellence has to have that kind of like moral basis where it aligns with your values.

00:46:27: Um because i would not call Lance Armstrong an excellent cyclist And thats a extreme example.

00:46:35: um Because he went about in way That was in alignment With uh The value Of sport.

00:46:43: Um I'd Call him a very proficient Cyclist.

00:46:46: Yeah go ahead.

00:46:47: No, he was a guest.

00:46:48: He's a guest on the podcast.

00:46:49: yeah and we We had a very open an honest conversation about this.

00:46:55: And I'm wondering is that because of?

00:46:58: The way that you went about it on personal level in between people Is it because they're doping?

00:47:05: what's the part that you think doesn't align?

00:47:09: Because you said that aligns with your values.

00:47:11: i mean it aligned with his values at the time clearly and You know

00:47:16: The doping did, but I think and i'd love to talk to Lance about this.

00:47:22: Well, the thing is I mean that

00:47:45: he makes a case in point That if you were with him or against them right?

00:47:48: You were in the team.

00:47:49: You are one of the guys and he would go all The way for you.

00:47:53: but you know He even describes the contradiction Of how he rode against riders who where just Sheer another pieces of shit in his mind And later on became best buddies because they were on his team and they changed.

00:48:07: and i find this old-school method of like hard rivalry where people are just angry and kind of channeled that anger into something, a really powerful emotion.

00:48:25: I agree.

00:48:26: however i would say in Lance's case the with or against eventually became... Are you willing to cover up this doping?

00:48:38: But um yeah, so I am so back to your initial question.

00:48:41: II think that the stand like you.

00:48:44: You can spend a lot of time Practicing basketball and have involved engagement in it And it could align with your values.

00:48:51: but if you can never make the ball go into hoop?

00:48:53: You're not an excellent basketball player.

00:48:55: Um So III guess like my definition like that that result or that standard is given.

00:49:02: However, at the same time I think that other standard matters is like are you giving the craft your all?

00:49:07: because as mentioned earlier.

00:49:10: The wins they happen and then immediately on to next thing.

00:49:14: so if just define yourself by outcome when it happens what's next?

00:49:19: Um, so I think it's this tension between process and outcome again not process over outcome.

00:49:23: Process and out come its attention between the two but i think that committing to an excellence process is what leads to the best outcomes.

00:49:32: yeah would agree hundred percent just understood.

00:49:34: you know where basically was a feel like your almost democratizing excellence in away at making up uh... lot more approachable which which I think is great that people go for it and that people try.

00:49:46: And develop these excellent habits, but for me, It's just something that has always been reserved to the few who are persistent enough That have a right process.

00:49:57: Let us be honest get lucky Just manage to have an excellent result.

00:50:04: So now this is like a philosophical conversation But i find really interesting.

00:50:08: There was difference between excellence in excellent.

00:50:12: Yes, I agree hundred percent.

00:50:14: so excellent is the standard.

00:50:15: and i didn't write a book called you know what is excellent.

00:50:19: Because that's a standard.

00:50:20: it is often defined by field so in your case its very clear at its time against the clock.

00:50:25: in anyway there isn't alignment with the rules of this sport.

00:50:28: In other cases music writing it is a standard.

00:50:32: or craft work carpenter it's a stand created by the culture of the fields.

00:50:36: what defines excellent?

00:50:38: but excellence is to me like the process.

00:50:42: And I do think that somebody could be pursuing excellence in triathlon, but never goes faster than twelve hours for an Ironman?

00:50:52: That doesn't make them and excellent triathletes... But their own life!

00:50:56: The pursuit of excellence is very real for them and they get all these same benefits.

00:51:02: if you go sub eight-hours You don't get financial benefits or opportunities But the spiritual benefits, if you are going about it in a way that your—you know.

00:51:14: You have integrity with your values and involved or committed... I mean…I'm sure you've met people!

00:51:18: You're very thoughtful self-reflective guy.

00:51:21: There's lot of world class athletes who for lack better terms is talking to rock And its like.

00:51:27: what'd ya get out?

00:51:28: Big paycheck Like thats'it.

00:51:30: Then u go talk some age grouper That went thirteen hours and they riff philosophical how going twelve fifty nine changed their life.

00:51:39: Again, the age group or doesn't have an excellent results but they definitely experienced excellence in their life and I think that's very good.

00:51:46: Yeah i'm glad you clarified that because for me it was kind of well... Excellent!

00:51:51: In that case how we defined is kinda like continuous comparison Of absolute ceiling That people can get to And guess there could be individual ceilings that were talking about.

00:52:06: I'm glad that you asked that question, because that's the biggest pushback i get to this book.

00:52:10: Which is just that.

00:52:11: it's like You're democratizing excellence And i say yeah Like.

00:52:15: i think everyone can experience The benefits of excellence and then they are like well uh what about someone That Just plays ymca basketball?

00:52:24: In in your gonna Say there as excellent as Steph Curry?

00:52:27: It's like no Cause I'm not talking about being, I'm NOT talking about an excellent result.

00:52:32: I'm talking about excellence as a process and that is a very important thing to tease out.

00:52:36: because you're right if i said That anyone can be excellent at anything?

00:52:41: I would want you to dismiss all of my work immediately Because that's just horseshit.

00:52:45: but thats not what im saying

00:52:47: And Im glad you clarified it.

00:52:48: cause.

00:52:49: Yeah yeah...I've been thinking about consuming It alot..and I really appreciate it because the Thing Is I like going after the process also part of this new project and things i do in life.

00:53:01: you know even as we talked about being a father, husband being general just living person.

00:53:09: I'm not going off to things and putting my heart into it but im okay with effect that i am never gonna be excellent at any of those most likely again the effort required and all of the many factors we spoke about.

00:53:25: Yeah, I think a great example is like...I do want to be an excellent writer-like.

00:53:30: i wanna be world class.

00:53:32: That's my goal.

00:53:33: However in powerlifting In The Gym..i experience alot of benefits of excellence, process & pursuit.

00:53:42: I am never going to have an excellent deadlift by any standard other than my own.

00:53:51: It so much You know talking about an ideal world where kind of all these things come together and how.

00:54:02: One other lines in the book I think is how you researched peak athletes, get older.

00:54:21: i guess with that your own ego dissipates a little bit but.

00:54:26: In terms of the whole process it's just something there really is unique to each and every person, and probably not healthy or an approach.

00:54:36: when you strike strife for excellence the way that you describe it?

00:54:40: I think so in i think what research would bear.

00:54:43: if u have the right genetics, You can follow my approach and be the best in the world.

00:54:54: It's not.

00:54:55: it's not like a. let's all hold hands and sing kumbaya, and though you have to have the right temperament because Let's say I don't know if Michael but even Mike okay So what I was gonna?

00:55:07: Say an I'm thinking through this on-the-fly is Steph Curry very much embodies.

00:55:13: My book Steve Curry One multiple championships as a player and then many more is the coach.

00:55:18: he's on the cover of the book endorsing it.

00:55:20: He said like this, This Is It?

00:55:30: And I wish, I tried to get in touch with MJ for the book.

00:55:35: I tried pull every lever he's a hard guy again and touched what they couldn't.

00:55:37: because i wanted ask him these questions.

00:55:39: you should have just said uh... I could've brought them around.

00:55:43: What's fascinating about someone like MJ is that he was coached by.. He only won his championships with Phil.

00:55:53: Jackson is like another person, the embodiment.

00:55:58: He's a Steve Kerr right?

00:55:59: Compassion joy mindfulness process relationships.

00:56:06: Kobe Bryant maybe more in the MJ spectrum than Steph Curry only won his championships with Phil Jackson.

00:56:12: there.

00:56:13: I truly don't think those guys careers would have looked very different.

00:56:16: not to take away from them at all.

00:56:17: they are phenomenal basketball players.

00:56:19: this truly some of you best ever someone argue top five ever somewhat argue for Jordan The Best Ever.

00:56:26: Um, would they have won championships without Phil Jackson?

00:56:28: I'm not sure.

00:56:29: But i can tell you that having that counterbalance That force that got them just to like look over their shoulder in the other direction even if only for a split second I think helped.

00:56:38: um yeah so So so so.

00:56:42: Even when you mention people like that and then I think what ends up happening too is Is on the internet.

00:56:47: You get these influencers and these personalities who?

00:56:51: Who?

00:56:51: who model this kind of like badass again?

00:56:54: It's all that matters is the result.

00:56:55: Don't worry about relationships any of this um, but by and large those people aren't Like.

00:57:02: they're not excellent at anything other than being an influencer on the internet.

00:57:08: So I don't want to name names because it won't get my ass beat.

00:57:10: But like so many of the biggest influencers in that camp like what their good at Is getting a lot of Instagram followers, but there are no winning races.

00:57:19: They're not starting companies that are changing the world, they're not winning Grammys from music.

00:57:26: You look at their life and how they engage with families.

00:57:30: if you have them it's nothing most people would want.

00:57:33: so I just think its really important to separate like That approach from what that approach actually gets you.

00:57:42: And I think your a really interesting example because it sounds like, You followed the approach at times in life and came out on other side as well rounded enough good person but when were in it?

00:57:52: So i would take advice looking to my wife.

00:57:55: I

00:57:57: will

00:57:58: take this advice for you before someone who is just hemming or hawing.

00:58:06: Well, that's the thing.

00:58:06: That's why I don't want to give that advice because it is not right and you're doing a great job dismantling all kind of saying if your winning or right.

00:58:18: The proof in putting those words earlier on which really often times just an excuse for shitty behavior.

00:58:28: we should probably strive for better.

00:58:35: Yeah, and there are so many examples of people doing it like I mentioned Steph Curry Steve Kerr Yana Sante de Kumpo.

00:58:42: Um i'm a big basketball fan So I pull from basketball.

00:58:45: um in in sport.

00:58:47: Um Alyssa Lou who just won this gold medal?

00:58:50: I think she's a great example Of what you talked about.

00:58:52: It sounds like You know everyone is talking About how it was Just joy And it Was all about Joy.

00:58:57: but What they don't realize Is that her father essentially forced Her to make her entire life figure skating until She quit.

00:59:04: Would she have won the gold medal if she didn't have that period where she quit?

00:59:07: I don't think so.

00:59:08: She doesn't think, but who knows!

00:59:10: But i guess like... That's back to that person.

00:59:13: Like it is not a how-to book because there are attention.

00:59:17: You know.

00:59:17: thats why The most underlined phrase in this book Is that the best performers Are a little bit crazy and obsessive Somewhat maniacal.

00:59:25: They just have enough awareness But they dont go over their edge And blow themselves up.

00:59:30: Thats really true.

00:59:32: Yeah, a hundred percent.

00:59:33: and like I said you know in some phases of your life You'll pull from the discipline chapter next.

00:59:38: You will find something in the gumption And then you'll find something In the caring and giving.

00:59:43: Brad i really appreciate Your work and what?

00:59:45: You've done also over The years Before.

00:59:49: let me go.

00:59:50: i would love to Know our closing question Which is when Is the last time you went mental?

00:59:57: Probably this morning.

00:59:58: To be honest

01:00:02: Tell us a little bit more.

01:00:02: Come on, you're gonna get just a little it more.

01:00:05: yeah um oh man It's back to shooting.

01:00:08: sixty percent.

01:00:09: uh this morning I was at the gym and Um i mean?

01:00:13: It wasn't full mental i'd say like diet mental mental light or mental zero.

01:00:17: You know like coke zero mental zero.

01:00:19: um No is that the jim in?

01:00:21: i'm very much A i'm allowed to swear right i've already sworn a few times.

01:00:25: i'm Very Much Like Fuck it and let it rip.

01:00:27: kind of athlete.

01:00:28: is an athlete like.

01:00:29: I'm the opposite Of The person that wears a whooper or an aura ring in like as worried about their recovery score.

01:00:34: Um, II send It.

01:00:36: so my problem Is III need to wear on order ringer a loop just slow myself down A little bit.

01:00:41: So this morning at the gym, I had a seated shoulder press and it was programmed for four to five reps.

01:00:48: Five sets of four-to-five reps.

01:00:49: in last week i hit one hundred forty-five pounds And um... It's like pretty heavy!

01:00:55: That was six reps.

01:00:56: so I'm gonna go up to one hundred fifty which is the logical jump.

01:00:59: but uhmm....I looked at the plates..and said that in order get into one hundred fifteen I'd have to get fives two and halfs And the tens are just right there.

01:01:07: So fuck it, I'm going to put the tens on and make a ten pound

01:01:09: jump.".

01:01:10: And I nailed that!

01:01:12: Back-to like be yourself in go all of way... That's just me.

01:01:16: In that story because everything comes back into this notion of being your self and go all away which is such an important part of excellence for me?

01:01:26: Being kind or trying to force myself to become my own person?

01:01:29: no, the program said only making five pounds jump.

01:01:32: go put the change plates on, two and a halfs do this exactly.

01:01:35: I would be much worse athlete because i'd be stress cadet.

01:01:39: it wouldn't enjoy it.

01:01:41: there are other athletes who if they saw what i did give them panic attack.

01:01:45: you have to know who u r in then channel that without killing you.

01:01:51: my biggest missteps injuries is both an athlete but also my biggest miss steps as writer.

01:01:59: You know when I put the tens on, When i'm about to get injured like no you can't Put the tens because your gonna tear Your hamstring.

01:02:06: so you've got a Know yourself.

01:02:07: You gotta know your tendencies.

01:02:08: You have to lean into them but also Gotta make sure that you look The other way just A bit.

01:02:13: Bravo!

01:02:14: I love it.

01:02:14: couldn'a said It better

01:02:16: Brad.

01:02:17: thank you this

01:02:17: was

01:02:17: a pleasure man.

01:02:19: This is cool

01:02:21: absolutely especially On the whole whooping aura and all these kind of things.

01:02:25: I have another ten topics, we'll.